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| Carbon Fiber a good idea in a neck? http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=7036 |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 1:46 pm ] |
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I was thinking about using one 1/4 x 1/4 carbon fiber rod on each side of a double action tress rod. This is in a 5 piece laminated mahogany SS neck. Is that a good idea? I'm afraid it will be so stiff it won't adjust when I need it too. What are your thoughts? |
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| Author: | John Mayes [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 2:21 pm ] |
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it's a good idea. Helps the strength. It's not absolutely needed, but it does help. And it will not hinder any truss rod adjustments. |
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| Author: | Mattia Valente [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 5:47 pm ] |
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Good idea. I like what it does. |
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| Author: | Todd Rose [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:16 pm ] |
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You might consider rods with a taller but narrower cross section. It's a good idea to clamp a neck into a slight bend in the direction you want to adjust it before cranking on the truss rod, to avoid the possibility of breaking the rod or stripping the threads - esp with a very stiff, carbon reinforced neck. |
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| Author: | Todd Rose [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:18 pm ] |
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BTW, many people feel that there's an improvement in sound when the neck is made as stiff as possible. |
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| Author: | A Peebels [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 10:10 pm ] |
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Why bother? It won't hurt anything, but I'd save the CF for bass guitars, and 24 fret electric guitar necks. Al |
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| Author: | Martin Turner [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 10:53 pm ] |
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[QUOTE=Todd Rose] BTW, many people feel that there's an improvement in sound when the neck is made as stiff as possible.[/QUOTE] "stiff and light"......its the rule I build to. |
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| Author: | Colin S [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 12:01 am ] |
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Yes I like to use it it stiffens up the neck and I believe stops some of the damping that can be exhibited with a floppy neck. I use 1/8" x 3/8" (vertically obviously) either side of the truss rod, across the headstock angle and under the fretboard extension. Colin |
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| Author: | Mattia Valente [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 12:53 am ] |
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Colin: ditto. Martin: CF rodded necks are stiffer than non-CF rod necks, but they're not lighter, generally. CF is very stiff for its weight, but it's heavier than mahogany, IIRC. |
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| Author: | rlabbe [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:05 am ] |
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[QUOTE=Mattia Valente]Martin: CF rodded necks are stiffer than non-CF rod necks, but they're not lighter, generally. CF is very stiff for its weight, but it's heavier than mahogany, IIRC.[/QUOTE] CF is heavier than a piece of mahogany of the same size. However, if you build 2 necks, one with CF and one without, and size them so they end up the same stiffness, then the one with CF will be lighter (because you can remove more material from the CF neck). It all depends on what you are aiming for. |
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| Author: | Mattia Valente [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:34 am ] |
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[QUOTE=rlabbe] [QUOTE=Mattia Valente]Martin: CF rodded necks are stiffer than non-CF rod necks, but they're not lighter, generally. CF is very stiff for its weight, but it's heavier than mahogany, IIRC.[/QUOTE] CF is heavier than a piece of mahogany of the same size. However, if you build 2 necks, one with CF and one without, and size them so they end up the same stiffness, then the one with CF will be lighter (because you can remove more material from the CF neck). It all depends on what you are aiming for.[/QUOTE] Indeed. Thing is, I build necks for feel, not to a specific stiffness, so the CF lets me do it without having to worry that the neck's going to end up too floppy. |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:09 am ] |
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It sounds like 1/8 x 3/8 is the favorite here. I just bought a stack of 1/4 x 1/4, guess I should use it up first. Thanks for the good info..... should have asked sooner. |
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| Author: | Martin Turner [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:54 pm ] |
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[QUOTE=Joe Beaver] It sounds like 1/8 x 3/8 is the favorite here. I just bought a stack of 1/4 x 1/4, guess I should use it up first. Thanks for the good info..... should have asked sooner.[/QUOTE] Joe, I use two 1/8" x 3/8" CF strips (from Stewmac) about 3-4mm each side of the truss rod trench on my steel string necks. The strips run all way from body end of neck through to headstock. Im also toying with idea of running short strips of CF through the headstock into the neck to cut risk of headstock/neck failure. |
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| Author: | Shane Neifer [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 2:56 am ] |
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I just bought a few rods from Jim Watts, a fellow OLF'er and advertiser (Los Alamos Composites, link above!). I bought some 1/8 x 3/8 for both guitars and basses and some 1/4 x 1/4 to use to support the neck block back to the waist in the same fashion that Doolin and others do to delay the neck re-set issue on the double necked acoustic I will start building late this coming fall. Jim is great to deal with, call him and get his advise when you are not sure. Shane |
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| Author: | Serge Poirier [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 3:59 am ] |
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[QUOTE=Joe Beaver] It sounds like 1/8 x 3/8 is the favorite here. I just bought a stack of 1/4 x 1/4, guess I should use it up first. Thanks for the good info..... should have asked sooner.[/QUOTE] Joe, since your rods are usually purchased for basses, a trade with someone building basses would sure help you out, just a thought... |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:04 am ] |
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Serge, That is a thought. I bought 8 of them from Jim Watts. I'm thinking they may be ok. They should add some stability. I might switch to the 3/8 stock subsequently. I was a little afraid that a 3/8 rod might lead to cracks in the neck if it gets to thin. |
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| Author: | Jim Watts [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:10 am ] |
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Joe, I use 1/4 X 1/4 a lot and set them into a slot thats between 5/16 and 3/8 deep in the neck and cap with an strip of rosewood. The 1/8 X 3/8 rods are meant to set in a 3/8" deep slot. These create a very stable neck. |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 11:51 am ] |
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Thanks Jim. That sounds like a plan..... |
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| Author: | Barry Daniels [ Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:51 am ] |
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I glue a couple of bundles of loose graphite fibers in a 1/8" wide slot with epoxy. Then I clamp a wood spline on top to force the excess glue out. I usually end up with a 1/4" high bar. Two of these bars stiffen up a neck just about right. An advantage of this approach is that I can easily bend the fibers so they flow into the headstock. |
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